Salvation Army joins Maori ward debate

File photo.

The Salvation Army is encouraging people in Whakatane to vote to keep a vital part of New Zealand democracy going. 

The Army is hoping people will vote to keep Maori wards in the upcoming poll in Whakatane. 

Salvation Army social policy and parliamentary unit director lieut-colonel Ian Hutson says there is a lack of Maori representation within local government that needs to change. 

“Maori wards are an important way to address this imbalance. In Whakatane, Maori make up 40 per cent of the population. 

“Maori wards allow Maori a voice. For our councils to truly reflect their communities Maori need a voice at the council table.” 

Ian says the polls are an opportunity to address this issue urgently. The results are binding, meaning if the proposed wards are overturned Councils cannot try to introduce a Maori Ward for several years. 

“The reality is Maori representation needs to occur now. The Salvation Army commends the movements to keep the Maori Wards and encourages the constituents to use their voice to vote to ensure they remain. 

“Maori wards are a reflection of The Treaty of Waitangi,” he says. “Partnership is a vital part of Te Tiriti. Clause two of the treaty specifies Maori have tino rangitiratanga; sovereignty and determination.

“Ensuring Maori are represented in Local Government is part of fulfilling this aspect of the treaty and respecting the partnership we have with tangata whenua,” Ian says. 

“Maori are also treated differently when it comes to the creation of Maori wards. Other wards are created at the discretion of the council without a public vote. Maori wards should not be treated differently,” Ian says. 

“Maori Wards should not be able to be changed through petition. This is a fundamental flaw within the legislation and needs to change. 

“We challenge the Government and the Governance and Administration Select Committee to change the Local Electorate Act to ensure Maori Wards cannot be repealed through poll.”


38 Comments

NZer, democracy is not equal treatment for all

Posted on 03-05-2018 08:48 | By Peter Dey

NZer, you need to have another look at your definition of democracy. Democracy has equal voting rights for all, and the law applies equally to all but that does not mean equal treatment for all. In NZ democracy Maori have extra Treaty rights as well as all the rights of British citizens. You do not understand democracy. Look it up and suck it up.

NZer, your belief is not uncommon but still wrong

Posted on 03-05-2018 08:27 | By Peter Dey

NZer you are ignorant about legal agreements. In law the meaning of an agreement depends not only on the wording but also on the intention of the parties who signed it. NZ Court judges have ruled that the Treaty of Waitangi is a partnership agreement because that was the intention when it was signed. This is now NZ law. The judges who made the ruling know more about law than you do.

You need more education, nzer

Posted on 02-05-2018 18:07 | By R. Bell

You agree a treaty is a contract, so far so good. Now, a partnership is the practical realisation of that contract. Hence the Banks you talk of saying things like " partner with us " when offering loans and other services. For as long as the contract lasts, it is indeed a "partnership". Oh!! dear. Robin Bell.

Nice try Dey

Posted on 02-05-2018 16:28 | By NZer

Please show me where in the Treaty it says a partnership? Funny how you cant show that. Because it is not there. It is a contract just like one you would have with your bank or employer or any other agreement. Does not mean you are in partnership with the bank or your boss does it so clearly it is a contract saying Maori will be treated the same as everyone else. unfortunately Dey seems to think Maori need to be treated differently so misuses the work Democracy. Dey does not understand Democracy and does not like the fact that Maori get outvoted democratically. Maori wards are not democratic otherwise other democracies would have them. Deys evidence is as usual all made up and the general public clearly do not support his views.

NZer, Maori wards do not change majority rules

Posted on 02-05-2018 13:22 | By Peter Dey

NZer, Maori wards are totally democratic. They make no change to majority rules. Majority rules does not mean that Maori can be ignored. The government has made it law that the Treaty must be respected. Democracy does not change that.

Democracy is constantly changing nzer

Posted on 02-05-2018 12:47 | By R. Bell

When Maori signed up to partner the Brits the majority didn’t rule in Britain or N.Z. Democracy in Britain meant only male landowners could vote. They were proud of their democracy but it was nothing like what we have today, reason being, change. Gradual, incremental unstoppable change, get used to it. Robin Bell.

NZer, majority rules is only part of the definition of democracy

Posted on 02-05-2018 12:37 | By Peter Dey

NZer, majority rules is only one part of the dictionary definition of democracy. One person one vote is also part of the definition. Do some more reading. You misunderstand democracy. What Maori were promised when signing the Treaty was democracy and partnership. That is now part of New Zealand law. The Salvation Army supports this.

Dey

Posted on 01-05-2018 17:16 | By NZer

You misuse the word Democracy. As per the dictionary it means majority rules. The reason we have a dictinary is so people like One eyed Pete cannot change the meaning to suit themselves. NZ law is based on majority rules. You will currently see this in action as Maori wards are voted on and the Majority will rule. And then Pete you will have to suck it up buttercup. Democracy in a nut shell for you. Nothing to do with one man one vote.

Democracy is a word, nzer

Posted on 30-04-2018 12:13 | By R. Bell

the real gist of which still sleeps ( in your mind). It is a great word, whose history remains unwritten because that history has yet to be enacted. Borrowed from Walt Whitman. A truly wise man.Like Peter Dey. Robin Bell.

NZer, Maori signed a partnership, you have to suck that up

Posted on 30-04-2018 11:07 | By Peter Dey

NZer, you keep repeating the same misunderstanding. The democracy that Maori signed up for is not your narrow idea. Maori signed up for democracy and partnership. You have to suck that up.

NZer, Maori signed up for partnership in the Treaty

Posted on 30-04-2018 10:57 | By Peter Dey

NZer, you say that Maori knew what they were signing up for when they signed the Treaty. It is you who do not know what they signed up for. You do not seem to know that Maori signed the Treaty as a partnership agreement, and that your idea of democracy is hugely ignorant. Maori wards do not have to be in the dictionary meaning of democracy to be democratic. They just have to be one person one vote. and they are.

NZer, Democracy is one person one vote.

Posted on 30-04-2018 10:43 | By Peter Dey

NZer, you still not producing any credible argument. Maori wards give everybody one person one vote. Maori get no more votes than anybody else so it is still democracy. AS the Salvation Army says Maori wards provide the partnership that is contained in the Treaty of Waitangi, and there is nothing undemocratic about this. You do not understand democracy.

Dey and Bell

Posted on 29-04-2018 09:20 | By NZer

Look up the word democracy in any dictionary. You will not see anthing about maori or any other cultures wards being mentioned. You need to get over yourself and stop whinging. Maori new full well what they were signing up for when they signed the treaty. Now you haveto live with the decision that maori made and suck it up....

NZer, you misunderstand democracy

Posted on 27-04-2018 16:30 | By Peter Dey

NZer, insulting people by calling them whingers without any argument to back up your insult just shows that you have no answer to what they say. The Salvation Army point is that the Treaty of Waitangi is a partnership agreement and that having Maori elected representatives on local councils is a part of that partnership agreement. Democracy is one person one vote and Maori wards have exactly that. They do not give Maori an extra vote, so they are fully democratic. People who think that the our present system is the only democratic one are simply ignorant. Just look at the different democratic system in the USA.

You live in a bubble, nzer

Posted on 27-04-2018 10:19 | By R. Bell

watch out for flying fish hooks, whoops,too late , POP. Robin Bell.

Dey and Bell

Posted on 27-04-2018 07:46 | By NZer

We fully understand Democracy. Maori did too when they signed the treaty. They knew they would be treated the same as everyone else. Stop whinging Dey. Get over it.

NZer, rastus, Captain Sensible you misunderstand democracy

Posted on 26-04-2018 14:19 | By Peter Dey

Democracy means one person, one vote and the majority rules. Maori wards do not change this so they are totally democratic. There in nothing in democracy that says there has to be one electoral roll for everybody. As the Salvation Army says, the present system is unfair to Maori. We have a Maori roll for parliamentary elections. We should use it for local elections to recognise the partnership of the Treaty.

NZer, rastus, Captain Sensible you misunderstand democracy

Posted on 26-04-2018 14:19 | By Peter Dey

Democracy means one person, one vote and the majority rules. Maori wards do not change this so they are totally democratic. There in nothing in democracy that says there has to be one electoral roll for everybody. As the Salvation Army says, the present system is unfair to Maori. We have a Maori roll for parliamentary elections. We should use it for local elections to recognise the partnership of the Treaty.

Robin

Posted on 25-04-2018 08:00 | By NZer

Maori signed the TOW knowing that they would get Democracy. They signed it so now you are stuck with it so no more whining please.

Corwen and MISSADVENTURE Treaty partnership is NZ law

Posted on 16-04-2018 21:17 | By Peter Dey

Parliament has now put into New Zealand law that the Treaty is a partnership agreement, because that was the intention when it was signed. As with any other legal agreement the intention of the signatories is part of the agreement. It is now New Zealand law that there is a partnership between the government and Maori. That updates the Treaty and Parliament has the authority to make New Zealand law.

Rubbish it aint' benny.

Posted on 16-04-2018 11:01 | By R. Bell

It is you that is in denial. No doubt a comfortable place. If you truly have the interests of Kiwi’s in mind, the question is this, Why do you deny Maori the basic human right to be represented at local body level, knowing full well, they are numerically outnumbered, why do you ignore the facts in the above article, and why do you vehemently oppose me, who simply wants justice for our minority partner? Big questions Benny, do you have any answers? Robin Bell.

groutby you are deliberate,

Posted on 15-04-2018 10:30 | By R. Bell

in your efforts to discredit. I remind you it was you who introduced the political connotation.Social justice and change are very much part of the Salvation Army agenda. The reference to Maori representation is not political in the sense you are trying ( and failing) to portray.It is not party political, it is social justice, long overdue as the above article asserts.Lobbying for Social justice is as political as you can get, without belonging to political parties.Study the word Political, you’ll see what I mean. Apologies gratefully accepted by me and no doubt the sallies. Robin Bell.

Just to be sure you understand how you are so wrong....

Posted on 14-04-2018 19:21 | By groutby

...Robin, coming from a Salvationist background, the Salvation Army affiliates with no political party as stated by themselves, you and other may wish to read this:http://www.salvationarmy.org.nz/our-community/faith-in-life/christian-ethics/TSA-not-apolitical

Groutby I'll try again,

Posted on 14-04-2018 10:12 | By R. Bell

just for the record. When you cut and paste from Wikipedia you are as selective as usual.. Go back to the site you copied and you will find much reference to political lobbying by the "sallys". I also suggest you don’t worry about my head, just concentrate on words like political and their full meaning. Robin Bell.

@ R Bell

Posted on 13-04-2018 03:25 | By BennyBenson

What a load of rubbish. Maori are quite capable of getting elected on their own merit like every other race in NZ. I couldn’t care less what race someone is, I’ll vote for who has the best interests of all Kiwi’s in mind.

Hilarious

Posted on 12-04-2018 21:30 | By Captain Sensible

Anyone who disagrees with R Bell, by wanting democracy, equality, and an end to race based privilege is immediately labelled a far right supporter. Hilarious!!

Robin, you are once again quite wrong....

Posted on 12-04-2018 19:30 | By groutby

...an excerpt from ’Wikipedia"..(ok I know, but it does make my point:....)"The Salvation Army is a Protestant Christian para-church and an international charitable organisation structured in a quasi-military fashion. The organisation reports a worldwide membership of over 1.7 million,[2] consisting of soldiers, officers and adherents collectively known as Salvationists. Its founders Catherine and William Booth sought to bring salvation to the poor, destitute, and hungry by meeting both their "physical and spiritual needs". It is present in 128 countries,[3] running charity shops, operating shelters for the homeless and disaster relief and humanitarian aid to developing countries". END.Nowhere in that do I see "political" aims, again Robin you see beliefs in your head that are not, and never have been fact.

Fact?

Posted on 12-04-2018 18:34 | By Centurion

’Fact, no non Maori will vote for Maori in that situation, soooooooo they are inevitably outnumbered 60-40, get it.’ (Robin Bell). Yet the electorate has demonstrated time and time again that it is willing to elect non European candidates ie Chinese, Indian, Iranian, etc, all totally out-numbered by NZ-born voters. Maori have the same opportunities as every other New Zealander, and can have the same input via a seat on a local council. So what holds them back?

Do the math rastus,

Posted on 12-04-2018 15:44 | By R. Bell

Before you embarrass yourself even further. Maori cannot get elected on Maori issues, Fact, no non Maori will vote for Maori in that situation, soooooooo they are inevitably outnumbered 60-40, get it. If a Maori candidate stood on Maori issues, as has happened, the 60% will come out and block it. Just as you will shortly witness in the upcoming referendum. IT IS A NATIONAL DISGRACE, and further evidence of deep seated prejudice. Robin Bell.

Wrong treaty quotes to

Posted on 12-04-2018 14:01 | By MISS ADVENTURE

There is no reference at all to "partnership" at all in the treaty, there is no reference to "self determination". The only reference of any importance is that part Maori cede completely 100% irrevokably any sovereignty that maybe they had. All pledged to the Queen also 100% irrevokably. I beleieve that Governor Hobson would not just be turning in his grave at the current circus of race based claims and preference he would in fact be spinning like a top.

No surprises there groutby.

Posted on 12-04-2018 12:53 | By R. Bell

Your perception of the "sally’s" has obviously been wrong for a long time. They have always been political, particularly on social issues. They have no" mandate" , they have a long, proud history of intervening where social AND political injustice occurs, just as in this case. Wake up to what is good, and you will see the light, just as the "sally’s" have. Robin Bell.

Partnership

Posted on 12-04-2018 12:47 | By Corwen

is not mentioned in the Treaty of Waitangi.

Forty percent

Posted on 12-04-2018 12:43 | By Centurion

of the population of Whakatane District. Isn’t that a large enough proportion to field and support suitable candidates for local government without going down the ’give me a seat just because I’m Maori’ separatist route?

Rubbish

Posted on 12-04-2018 12:27 | By rastus

What a load of unintelligent rubbish we have here - on the one hand they are saying that Maori are not fairly represented yet on the other they tell us that Maori make up 40% of the population of that area. Given the published facts of how many people (%) vote it is then pretty obvious that Maori in this area do not vote for Maori’s standing for election in that area, so logically the answer is in their own hands. Also as an observation,If those of us who believe in democracy are going to be insulted by the likes of R Bell then there is obviously no chance of intelligent debate.

SA...a political organisarion now?

Posted on 12-04-2018 10:54 | By groutby

....Up to now I have been in support of, and had admiration for the Salvation Army.Their valuable assistance with compassion and netrality to thise in need has been outstanding. To have publicly taken a specific stance on a specific situation for a specific race I would have thought quite outside of their mandate. Agree or disagree with the plea from the organisation, this has changed my perception completely..and not for good...

wards

Posted on 12-04-2018 08:19 | By dumbkof2

so can we have chinese, indian. japanese. and all other races and even god forbid australian wards as well

At last some common sense,

Posted on 12-04-2018 08:08 | By R. Bell

from an influential group. Surely ti is time to do away with the prejudice, indifference and blatant misinformation being touted by supporters of the far right and their puppets in local gov’nt. Robin Bell.

No more donations from me

Posted on 12-04-2018 07:37 | By Captain Sensible

I have given my last donation to them then. I can never give my hard earned money to a racist organisation determined to discriminate against 85% of kiwi and thus making us second class kiwis. Sad that. They should concentrate on doing what they do best and keep out of politics.

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